Racism debate on r2

Yellow people aren't yellow either.

It's toss

meandlis said:

Mild and inoffensive to whom?

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Just people that tend to pick up on people's words of expression for people of different cultures and every word that is uttered out of anyone's mouths is judged without asking for explanation. Its a sad world.

Vxxx

I think we would look funny pure white and a little scary

Vxxx

Vanezza said:

Its a sad world.

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But, isn't a good thing that we are beginning to ask ourselves whether certain language, particular words are acceptable or not?

Vanezza said:

I think we would look funny pure white and a little scary

Vxxx

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D'you know race didn't exist before 1600?

It wasn't until Europeans went around the world in boats with guns and flags and encountered other, browner people and decided they quite liked the looks of the brown people's land... and they started to think, "How come we are superior?"

And they had new scientific ideas and were busy classifying all the plants and animals in the world and it seemed natural to do the same thing with humans.

So they created a hierarchy, with white people at the top and black people at the bottom.

It seemed to make sense at the time. 200 years ago.


And we're still struggling to see that's utterly false.

meandlis said:

But, isn't a good thing that we are beginning to ask ourselves whether certain language, particular words are acceptable or not?

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True to a degree yes but some is so mild that it makes me question things. Like you can't say merry Christmas in fear of offending someone and the nursery rhyme baa baa Black sheep is a no no. Its now baa baa multicoloured sheep and I just can't visualise a multi coloured sheep

Vxxx

meandlis said:

But, isn't a good thing that we are beginning to ask ourselves whether certain language, particular words are acceptable or not?

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Should white people ever sing the N-word?

DiamondJoe said:

Should white people ever sing the N-word?

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Personally no one should use the N word its not a nice word and is a word widely used during slavery so singers of any race should stop using it.

Vxxx

Vanezza said:

Personally no one should use the N word its not a nice word and is a word widely used during slavery so singers of any race should stop using it.

Vxxx

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I'm with you on that - I don't think use of the word elevates anyone.

DiamondJoe said:

Should white people ever sing the N-word?

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Vanezza said:

Personally no one should use the N word its not a nice word and is a word widely used during slavery so singers of any race should stop using it.

Vxxx

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DiamondJoe said:

I'm with you on that - I don't think use of the word elevates anyone.

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Aye agreed, no one should... but they do. Especially in rap & hip-hop and it's not a fekin "new thing" either. For example, NWA (name says it all) have been using the term from day 1.
Should we now slap down 'white people' for saying the N-word when singing along to a rap or song that uses it?
Absolutely fucking not.
Should we slap down 'white people' for saying the N-word for no reason other than to hurt others?
Then absolutely we should.

To cry outrage at youths/kids saying it to rap is mind-blowingly stupid, overly sensitive and mundane.
Hell, the other week during a party in the garden, our 15 y.o who is rap obsessed (think he follows me a little ) was saying it, IN TIME to a rap he was listening to. One was by XXXTentacion and the other by NWA after I was showing him a video about the black ghetto culture which started trip-hop/hip-hop/rap.
Was he wrong for doing so?
No. No way.
The authors are wrong for doing so.... stay away from it and don't use it in the first place, else you will have young, impressionable teenagers and young adults such as our 15 y.o repeating the same.
Even more so if it's actually part of the fekin song!

As it happens, incidentally on this subject, he and I plus @Pearls were discussing the same this morning in the car. XXXTentacion came up again as were were discussing Glitch, Rap and Hip-hop. I was telling him about Soundcloud mixes, scratching and again, the whole black/white situation across the pond - specifically in the Bronx, Ghetto and Brooklyn etc.
These kids are being butchered by their own people but more so the police who are meant to protect them.
Anyway, the song I referred to about this, is 'Look at me' by XXXTentacion which I cannot share here. I did share a version of it in the Music Thread the other day, but full version I cannot.
Anyway, he talks and raps about how brutal life is there for being a young, black teen/youth/young adult.
America have racism deep rooted into their blood which I find ironic as they're not native Americans are they....

Racism, is a man-made thing. We're not born racist!
We bleed the same, eat the same, feel the same, cry the same... skin colour has nothing to do with being a human being and how we are.
Sadly those who are racist, have no space in my heart or sq foot of living space.
It will always exist and you cannot stop it. You can help eradicate and educate, but it will never cease.

FWIW here is NWA for you to highlight what I mean regarding the lyrics;

Lips_Pearls said:

FWIW here is NWA for you to highlight what I mean regarding the lyrics;

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Aside from the point made above about the discussion, the other point is to highlight how 'mainstream' the term is and has been in music for a long time.
You can't easily stop it when it's used so commonly by so many artists.. etc.

Therapon said:

It did, you only need look at Arabian history and their enslavement of Africans.

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Romans did it too didn’t they?

Therapon said:

It did, you only need look at Arabian history and their enslavement of Africans.

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But there is no philosophical, ideological, pseudo-scientific basis to the Arab slave trade. It is a fiction to suggest that only Arabs were involved in the slave trade. The slavery had existed from ancient times and was prevalent in ancient Greece, Rome, the near east, Mesopotamia, China, India... wherever you care to look... as well as in north Africa.

Slavery in medieval Europe - Wikipedia

Therapon said:

I was in no way suggesting only the Arabs were involved, it was an example as were my following posts. And as I also mentioned it was the Europeans who took things to an entirely different level but based on what was, probably for them at the time, normal. Of course slavery has existed as long as humans and will probably endure, in some form, for years to come.

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Yep.

Estimates of the number of slaves in the world today range from 21-46 million. Mauritania is the worst offender today, with 5% of the population estimated to be in slavery. Might not sound like much but 5% is 1 in 20 people

While there is an obvious connection, slavery and racism are two different subjects, surely?

meandlis said:

While there is an obvious connection, slavery and racism are two different subjects, surely?

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Yes... although there is overlap because slavery implies (as well as racism) inferiority, lack of human rights and low social status - all of which could be used to define racism anyway.

Slavery was/is an institution of enforced labour that we in the West mostly abhor. Historical slavery in South America or in the southern US of course had a racial basis. But the institution of slavery can be colour-blind, such as modern slavery in India, Pakistan or China.

Racism is the belief in the superiority of one race over another, that results in discrimination and prejudice towards people based on their colour or ethnicity.

Today, the use of the term "racism" does not easily fall under a single definition - it covers a multitude of sins and, as I maintain, it is a false ideology built on pseudo-science that still echoes around our thoughts, words and culture today.


Racism vs slavery.

Shit vs shite, basically.

DiamondJoe said:

it is a false ideology built on pseudo-science that still echoes around our thoughts, words and culture today.

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I agree, 100% but, for the purposes of this discussion, I think we're getting a bit off-track by debating whether slavery is racist or not.

What do you think of this?

Netflix comms boss Jonathan Friedland sacked over 'N-word' Netflix comms boss sacked over 'N-word'

Lips_Pearls said:

What do you think of this?

Netflix comms boss Jonathan Friedland sacked over 'N-word' Netflix comms boss sacked over 'N-word'

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Seems to me that he'd been told once, then he used it in a meeting with black colleagues? He's supposed to be a communication expert ffs

Therapon said:

But it is part of racism and probably one of the main reasons why it is being discussed in the first place.
However, racism is, as @DiamondJoe said above, intitutionalised into our everyday lives and I'd say we have all, at sometime in our lives been racist even if, as an example, I called the driver who cut me up a sheep shagger simply because the car they were in had a Welsh flag sticker on it. In fact I have would probably have no idea of his ethic origin but hopefully you get my drift.

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Sheep shaggers lol, guilty as charged, it's all in the technique and you have to wear the correct wellies